[Benn]

Brenda Brenda:

I doubt she will be well enough to attend her own court martial.

Then she will be found in contempt and charged :p

[Gunnair]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Gunnair Gunnair:

Huh.....another failure of the media litmus test.

It's CBC's fault, unless they break stories about Senator Duffy dontchaknow? Then they are good. And not mentioned.

I'd +5 you, but it's too soon.

Just in case you misunderstood. This is one of those things that DND doesn't like occurring because it wouldn't pass a media litmus test - or the Globe and Mail test. Irrespective of what the sailor did, the media and public will focus on a woman suffering from not only a permanent medical category that will have her released, but a positive for breast cancer. The only thing that makes it worse is the fact hat the CM is occurring on a chemo day.

There is a lot of failure here.

[fifeboy]

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

you just noticed that xort bus was more than a little challenged??

Sorry, my bad! And for the best pun so far this year.

[Freakinoldguy]

I never believed in that call in sick bullshit especially when I was on a ship. If any of my people phoned in sick I made them either come in and see the Sick Bay Tiffy or I went and got them and took them to the base hospital.

Either way they were screwed because despite what the Wardroom thinks the Military isn't a 9 to 5 union job where you get so may sick days a year. Alot of times when the young sailor showed up to work they smelled of alcohol, amazing isn't it especially when they tried to convince me that it was the cough syrup that made them smell like that.

It only took a couple of times and the kids knew the drill and came to work sick or hungover, and pretty soon they understood why I and my PO's were doing that. If they were sick they'd get the help they needed and be sent or taken home to recover but, if they were hungover they got a kick in the ass and depending how bad they were got sent rope stores to count strands in the towing hawser for 4 hours so they could get recover.

[Thanos]

Pretty sure that someone fighting a vicious disease is a lot different though than some bozo not making it in because he got shitfaced at the peeler bar the night before. Given the optics here I'm wondering if the court martial will be obtuse enough to hit her up with extra charges if she can't show up because she's at home puking her guts out from the chemo.

We're not at war here. Someone in a command position should have cut her some slack and not given the navy a black eye by appearing to be so cruel and heartless to a service member in this position.

[Freakinoldguy]

True but it's about more than optics. She felt a lump in her breast and then took 2 hours to get to the Base Hospital?

Maybe she was distraught by her discovery but there are numerous other reasons for a lump in your breast, cysts. scar tissue or whatever and most people would have headed for the hospital as soon as they were told to by their bosses.

So the questions are what was she doing for the 2 hours that she was absent. Why would the Navy even care if she took 2 hours to get to the hospital because most of the time as long as your accounted for they won't take such draconian actions as charging a person for something as benign as being 2 hours adrift for getting to the hospital. And since she did comply with the order only late which resulted in the Absent without Authority why did they chose to proceed with a much more serious charge of Disobeying a lawful command as the primary charge?

If I were a betting man I'd say there's alot more to this whole scenario than meets the eye and given the fact that IIRC all charges now have to be approved by the JAG now who is a lawyer and they likely wouldn't go with these charges unless they thought they could make them stick or wouldn't even have let them be laid for that matter. But since they went to such lengths It would appear that someone has a major hard on for her and it might not have anything to do with cancer/

So IMO the cancer diagnosis may just be a ploy to embarrass the Military into staying the charges that they laid for whatever reason and may or may not have anything to do with her 2 hour journey to the Base Hospital.

BTW that's one of the reasons we made our people come in or went and got them was because if they were sick and left at home alone what would have happened if they died or ended up a lot sicker than they would have been had they not seen a medical professional? We would have been crucified for not taking care of our people. So yes some were drunk but some were sick and I've seen a kid who phones in sick sent to the Base Hospital with what they thought was a stomach virus and then he ended up having his appendix removed because it had burst. So there's two sides to every story even this one.

[commanderkai]

Am I bad for thinking there HAS to be more to this story? I mean, come on! I know the government and military can have awful PR at times, but this is just mind bogglingly stupid, that anybody with any modicum of sense would have realized this was a very dumb move.

[Vamp018]

"In the US I often think the only reason we still keep Thule AFB active is because it's a perfect place to station people for what really amounts to a non-judicial punishment detail. Seems to me you folks need to ask to keep a joint garrison there."

Now Now Bart, stop knocking on Thule AFB. I did a 9 month TDY there twice in my time for SAR. It wasn't for punishment, but positioned me closer to Canada's CFS Alert for partaking in the RCAF's Operation Nanook. Best darn experience and hospitality in the Canadian Arctic playground Alert and the USAF Club Thule. Right about now I'd love to get assigned there instead of roasting in Texas err. By the Way the USCG has the worst punishment, CGAS Attu, way out on the Alaskan Islands edge of the Bering. Even today's Jar-Heads are scared of that place called the Coast Guard Alaskan Gulag.

Now as a USCG Active CDR, Freakinoldguy nailed it on the head imo on the matter of calling in sick.

[Freakinoldguy]

commanderkai commanderkai:

Am I bad for thinking there HAS to be more to this story? I mean, come on! I know the government and military can have awful PR at times, but this is just mind bogglingly stupid, that anybody with any modicum of sense would have realized this was a very dumb move.

Nope. Your likely right. This is a lot of trouble to go to for a two hour trip even for the Military.

[ShepherdsDog]

$1:

By the Way the USCG has the worst punishment, CGAS Attu, way out on the Alaskan Islands

Don't you mean the Aleutians?

[QBall]

$1:

Deyoung said she felt a growing lump in her breast last June and called in sick.

She felt a lump in her breast and she thought the best course of action was NOT to go see the medical staff? Hmmm....

[Gunnair]

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

True but it's about more than optics. She felt a lump in her breast and then took 2 hours to get to the Base Hospital?

Maybe she was distraught by her discovery but there are numerous other reasons for a lump in your breast, cysts. scar tissue or whatever and most people would have headed for the hospital as soon as they were told to by their bosses.

So the questions are what was she doing for the 2 hours that she was absent. Why would the Navy even care if she took 2 hours to get to the hospital because most of the time as long as your accounted for they won't take such draconian actions as charging a person for something as benign as being 2 hours adrift for getting to the hospital. And since she did comply with the order only late which resulted in the Absent without Authority why did they chose to proceed with a much more serious charge of Disobeying a lawful command as the primary charge?

If I were a betting man I'd say there's alot more to this whole scenario than meets the eye and given the fact that IIRC all charges now have to be approved by the JAG now who is a lawyer and they likely wouldn't go with these charges unless they thought they could make them stick or wouldn't even have let them be laid for that matter. But since they went to such lengths It would appear that someone has a major hard on for her and it might not have anything to do with cancer/

So IMO the cancer diagnosis may just be a ploy to embarrass the Military into staying the charges that they laid for whatever reason and may or may not have anything to do with her 2 hour journey to the Base Hospital.

BTW that's one of the reasons we made our people come in or went and got them was because if they were sick and left at home alone what would have happened if they died or ended up a lot sicker than they would have been had they not seen a medical professional? We would have been crucified for not taking care of our people. So yes some were drunk but some were sick and I've seen a kid who phones in sick sent to the Base Hospital with what they thought was a stomach virus and then he ended up having his appendix removed because it had burst. So there's two sides to every story even this one.

JAG only gets involved if charges aren't the big five, though they always suggest consultation. JAG does get involved in sentencing if only to establish a standard.

As for the woman, I should hope there is a lot more involved than the facts presented. Two hours adrift after calling in sick to get to the hospital? Chalk that up to big deal. Worthy of charges and the cost of a court martial? No. The fact they laid electable charges means either there is much more to it or somebody offered some colossally bad legal advice. And now, DND gets dragged through the media muck over something that could have potentially been sorted out administratively.

[stratos]

If she had legit reason for taking 2hrs to get to the hospital I don't think the Military would have an issue with her. To say ohhh she has cancer leave her be is not the point. She, at the time of the incident, did not know she had cancer so what exactly was she doing during the 2hr period? I feel sorry for her and wish her the best. I think its kind of blowing things out of preportion to do the whole Court Martial but then again she was given opptions of lesser forms of judical hearings and chose to go this route. Now she wants to complain about having to deal with it.

I know it sounds like I'm taking both sides but what it comes down to for me is what is the reason it took 2hrs for you to get to the Hospital. The rest is either the Military over reacting or her now complaining about the choices she made in regards for wanting the Court Martial procedings when given the option for less stressfull hearings.

[stratos]

$1:

AND, why can't court take chemo into consideration? I doubt she will be well enough to attend her own court martial.

The court starts in the morning, probably will be just a half day afair. Her Chemo starts in the afternoon. As for the rest of the days for court I would think and hope the Military does take the therapy into consideration.

$1:

Why did they start chemo so late??

Very good question, Im sure the doctors do have their reasons. What those would be i've no freaking idea.

[stratos]

Okay something seems a bit fishy to me. In the pic she appears to be loseing her hair. You do not lose your hair do to cancer, correct? It's the Chemo that causes you to lose your hair. She maybe on some other type of treatment that causes hair loss but i've never heard of any kind that makes you lose your hair.

Any of you know an answer to this?