[Goober911]

PostFactum PostFactum:

Goober911 Goober911:

But this would be possible. Both accepting that Ukraine is essential to Russian and Western security.
Posted earlier.

Then NATO must make it clear, Ukraine borders are inviolate.
NATO guarantees up to and including all Military action will be used to guarantee these borders.
No NATO troops / assets will deploy to the Ukraine.
Any invasion of Ukraine will be declared an Act of War against NATO countries.
Ukraine is defined as essential to NATO security.
Ukraine will not be admitted to NATO.

Immediate deployment of UN assets - OSCE to oversee the return of Govt facilities to the present Ukraine Govt. Force if required will be used.
Ensure a fair election.

Begin forward deployment of assets to the front line states.
Begin the plans that were in effect during the Cold War, mobilizing and deploying military assets from the States & Canada.

And lastly - It ain't gonna happen.

Your plan cost a lot of money, noone would like them to pay for Ukraine.

Yes it would, 10's of billions over time. But it would stop Russian expansion.

[PostFactum]

Goober911 Goober911:

Yes it would, 10's of billions over time. But it would stop Russian expansion.

Cheaper will be to kill Putin.

[Goober911]

PostFactum PostFactum:

Goober911 Goober911:

Yes it would, 10's of billions over time. But it would stop Russian expansion.

Cheaper will be to kill Putin.

This would be money well spent. Just costs in market changes could have paid for it.
The message would not be just for Russia, China as well.

[Winnipegger]

Goober911 Goober911:

PostFactum PostFactum:

Goober911 Goober911:

Yes it would, 10's of billions over time. But it would stop Russian expansion.

Cheaper will be to kill Putin.

This would be money well spent. Just costs in market changes could have paid for it.
The message would not be just for Russia, China as well.

Ever see the movie Death of a President? It shows how extreme reaction to such an action would make matters much much worse. Russia is autocratic, imaginate how much worse they would react.

[Goober911]

Winnipegger Winnipegger:

Ever see the movie Death of a President? It shows how extreme reaction to such an action would make matters much much worse. Russia is autocratic, imaginate how much worse they would react.

By invading Eastern Ukraine? Is that how Vlad would react.
Problem is the West has been reacting and not acting.

[Winnipegger]

The west really should send a large contingent of police. Not troops, police. With Chinook helicopters for rapid response.

[andyt]

Goober911 Goober911:

PostFactum PostFactum:

Goober911 Goober911:

Yes it would, 10's of billions over time. But it would stop Russian expansion.

Cheaper will be to kill Putin.

This would be money well spent. Just costs in market changes could have paid for it.
The message would not be just for Russia, China as well.

Hi Rambo.

[Goober911]

Winnipegger Winnipegger:

The west really should send a large contingent of police. Not troops, police. With Chinook helicopters for rapid response.

That would be seen as interference in Ukraines revolt. They would be labeeled as CIA- and such.
I laid out what NATO should do.
Think of Mar 36, Hitler and the Rhineland.

[Goober911]

Goober911 Goober911:

Yes it would, 10's of billions over time. But it would stop Russian expansion.

Goober911 Goober911:

This would be money well spent. Just costs in market changes could have paid for it.
The message would not be just for Russia, China as well.

andyt andyt:

Hi Rambo.

Nope. Not Rambo. No troops involved- Security Guarantees. «Done all the time.
The new Cold War is here. Deal with it.

[saturn_656]

[Goober911]

saturn_656 saturn_656:

[Winnipegger]

Goober911 Goober911:

Winnipegger Winnipegger:

The west really should send a large contingent of police. Not troops, police. With Chinook helicopters for rapid response.

That would be seen as interference in Ukraines revolt. They would be labeeled as CIA- and such.
I laid out what NATO should do.
Think of Mar 36, Hitler and the Rhineland.

Pro-Russian "protestors" arrested in Odessa were from Russia and Transnistria. They aren't Ukrainian. So Russia is already interfering; how could they complain?

[Goober911]

Winnipegger Winnipegger:

Goober911 Goober911:

Winnipegger Winnipegger:

The west really should send a large contingent of police. Not troops, police. With Chinook helicopters for rapid response.

That would be seen as interference in Ukraines revolt. They would be labeeled as CIA- and such.
I laid out what NATO should do.
Think of Mar 36, Hitler and the Rhineland.

Pro-Russian "protestors" arrested in Odessa were from Russia and Transnistria. They aren't Ukrainian. So Russia is already interfering; how could they complain?

But we have everyone in NATO, Military assets, economic sanctions that can be applied, running around like chicken little.
Myself I support what I wrote. I do understand the position the Ukraine Govt is in.
Others like Andy would rush in like fools.

And this is what would happen under Vlad
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/arti ... 99385.html

[Winnipegger]

Ok. But Ukraine is going to have to get itself under control. Can't hold an election like this. As western Ukraine truely secure? If so, then "protestors" who have vandalized government buildings etc. should be transfered to remand in western Ukraine. Somewhere secure. And Ukraine is going to have to arrest those who storm government buildings. I'm visualizing something equivalent to a Griffon medium helicopter dropping riot control teams via fast-rope. Secure a landing zone, and land Chinook helicopters fully loaded with crowd control police. Busses with expanded steel over the windows are all you need to transport prisoners. Canada was able to assemble a very large police presense in Toronto, drawing on police from practically every city in the country. Could Ukraine do the same?

[Goober911]

Winnipegger Winnipegger:

Ok. But Ukraine is going to have to get itself under control. Can't hold an election like this. As western Ukraine truely secure? If so, then "protestors" who have vandalized government buildings etc. should be transfered to remand in western Ukraine. Somewhere secure. And Ukraine is going to have to arrest those who storm government buildings. I'm visualizing something equivalent to a Griffon medium helicopter dropping riot control teams via fast-rope. Secure a landing zone, and land Chinook helicopters fully loaded with crowd control police. Busses with expanded steel over the windows are all you need to transport prisoners. Canada was able to assemble a very large police presense in Toronto, drawing on police from practically every city in the country. Could Ukraine do the same?

Check the link and see why many. read all front line former countries under the former USSR are nervous as hell.

http://www.baltictimes.com/news/articles/34774/